R-CALF riled over checkoff snub

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Comments (25) Leave a comment 

mo  |  September, 21, 2012 at 09:24 AM

Anyone remotely associated with any animals rights group should not be allowed a foot in the door. They want to control the money and due even more damage to animal agriculture. They have and will continue to promote ideas that only drive up the cost of production at all levels and ultimately cost the consumers dollars more to eat. What is ironic is that the very idea they promote, which is less animal concentration, is exactly what the outcome becomes. Some concerns cannot aford the increases in cost of production without the volume.

Midwest  |  September, 21, 2012 at 09:58 AM

NCBA and USDA are just like any arm of government, without any disciplines they force us to pay for something we do not have any control over, then use those very dollars to further groups and actions that all of us are against. Otherwise our checkoff dollar is demanded and then used against us in actions or support of groups that as cattlemen we are totally against {HSUS fraud packer control} If we had a way of controlling NCBA and what they did with our money, and it is our money, there would be more support. R-calf is out because they have to work for their dollars and actually support the cow/calf man. This whole affair stinks of communism and should be completely stopped and re-worked. R-calf keep up the good work and do not let this runawy train get us down. Remember most of us support a check-off that is HONESTLY used for our industry. Demand they let you in the door for their little meeting. This is ridiculous to exclude a group that is actually supported by cattlemen.

USA  |  September, 21, 2012 at 10:42 AM

R-calf is not a national orginization which represents cattlemen. County cattelmens association has more members. They (R-calf) needs to realise that the vast majority of cattle producers want nothing to do with them, that they do not represent anything more than a kook fringe, and they belong outside of any meeting if not commited to a mental institution along with their just as kookie affiliates at OCM.

Oklahoma  |  September, 21, 2012 at 10:55 AM

Wow. Almost nothing in your rambling response is true. NCBA is not a government agency, nor is it funded by check off dollars. NCBA is funded by DUES just like R-CALF. Additionally, polls have shown that the vast majority of cattlemen and women support the check off. R-CALF is merely a fringe extremist group that considers itself mainstream. No check off funds are paid to HSUS or packers, not to mention the fact that just because you don't like one segment of our industry doesn't mean that they're fraudulent. Check off dollars are used for PROMOTION and RESEARCH. Lastly, NCBA is a member driven organization. If you wish to make changes in NCBA, you merely have to join and begin voting on matters, as is your right. The problem R-CALF and other fringe groups have is that they are the vast minority. Most of the cattlemen and women support NCBA and it's efforts to further our industry. If you go to the meetings and our point of view is voted down, it is not because NCBA is crooked. It is because your viewpoint is not shared by the majority of other producers, hence your minority status. That means that your and R-CALF's membership's opinion are NOT MAINSTREAM. Get it?

Oklahoma  |  September, 21, 2012 at 10:57 AM

Wow. Almost nothing in your rambling response is true. NCBA is not a government agency, nor is it funded by check off dollars. NCBA is funded by DUES just like R-CALF. Additionally, polls have shown that the vast majority of cattlemen and women support the check off. R-CALF is merely a fringe extremist group that considers itself mainstream. No check off funds are paid to HSUS or packers, not to mention the fact that just because you don't like one segment of our industry doesn't mean that they're fraudulent. Check off dollars are used for PROMOTION and RESEARCH. Lastly, NCBA is a member driven organization. If you wish to make changes in NCBA, you merely have to join and begin voting on matters, as is your right. The problem R-CALF and other fringe groups have is that they are the vast minority. Most of the cattlemen and women support NCBA and it's efforts to further our industry. If you go to the meetings and our point of view is voted down, it is not because NCBA is crooked. It is because your viewpoint is not shared by the majority of other producers, hence your minority status. That means that your and R-CALF's membership's point of view are NOT MAINSTREAM. Got it?

midwest  |  September, 21, 2012 at 11:34 AM

Chris: Are you a cattleman??? Are you from one of the largest cattle areas in the country. You need to talk to the REAL producers. What is NCBA. It is not member driven. The control is taken away from the state associations and we have NO CHOICE but to pay that check-off dollar. It is used for things that the people paying for it do NOT approve of. I am forced to pay for it and I do not have a say in what it is spent on . There is fraud in the NCBA and that has been proven. There will be more because that is the nature of the beast. Why not give the producers and that means all of them an opportunity to vote on all of these issues. R-calf is not a fringe group and highly thought of among actual producers. They don't pander to the packing companies that the NCBA does. You can't BUY a place on their board. There are all kinds of ouchy subjects in this and you have your blinders on. Do you work for NCBA???

midwest  |  September, 21, 2012 at 01:26 PM

Deb:Do you work for HSUS?
Once R-Calf got into bed with that organization and the statement they made, most of the cattle people I know were done with them.
I am not a member of, and don't agree with everything the NCBA does. However, I have not seen that organization partner with an anti-ag group.

midwest  |  September, 21, 2012 at 01:32 PM

What statement did they make??

midwest  |  September, 21, 2012 at 02:00 PM

Sorry, my error. It was the OCM President who said “OCM and every cowboy out there owes a deep gratitude to the Humane Society of the United States.”

We all know that Fred Stokes, Mike Callicrate and the OCM are in NO WAY connected to or are affiliated with R-Calf.

My statement on the feelings of the cattle people I know about R-calf, OCM and the above statement still stand.

Texas  |  September, 21, 2012 at 02:29 PM

Communism! My god, Joe McCarthy has returned from the dead. Do you even know what communism is?

61858  |  September, 21, 2012 at 03:32 PM

Sam is right. R-Calf stepped init long ago and lost credit with many producers. I am not a big NCBA fan but they are the best of the worst.

61858  |  September, 21, 2012 at 03:34 PM

Especially USDA! HSUS our own domestic terrorist organization!

Montana  |  September, 21, 2012 at 03:45 PM

How can R-CALF maintain its followers if they don't create a crisis that the victim mentality, entitlement crowd can buy into? It's always someone elses fault to these folks.

Oklahoma  |  September, 21, 2012 at 03:54 PM

Chris it apears being mainstreams is very important to you. Have you ever heard that when everybody's doing the same thing, i.e. being mainstream, they're probably wrong. Noah is a great example of someone who wasn't mainstream, and he was condemed just as you condem those who aren't "mainstream" today in the beef industry. If you'll recall, God sealed the door of the Ark to keep Noah out of the mainstream. Meanwhile the mainstream folks died right where they were, in the biggest of all mainstreams'. Cattlemen desperately need someone other than NCBA to represent their interests. R-Calf may not be it, but neither is NCBA. It just means we need to create a new mainstream, and economics is presently working in that direction. Think a little out of the box Chris, even dare to think a little bigger.

SD  |  September, 21, 2012 at 07:24 PM

Deb, I believe you are not knowledgeable, or you misunderstand what the checkoff $$$ may and may not be used for. It is clearly spelled out in the Act and Order creating the Beef Check Off.

All contracts are on a cost recovery only basis. Meaning there is NO profit. That just may be one reason few groups or people bid on contracts, IMO!

The vote of producers all over the nation caused you to have to pay the Beef Checkoff. No organization forces you to do that. The law creating it does!

All decisions of how to spend the money are made by the CBB which is representatives of ALL national cattle organizations in the country in existence when the checkoff was voted in. The reason for limiting it that way was to prevent new groups being formed to take advantage of the money. HOWEVER, there are R-CALF members on the CBB. And there are members of many groups, including the several signing that letter to R-CALF, serving on the CBB today.

NCBA Dues Division is supported by membership dues AND by some Agri-businesses who are willing to help out so that they can more easily access cattle producer members with whom they hope to do business. NCBA gains members because of the educational programs, friendships, and opportunities to talk to people in those other segments of beef production. R-CALF seems to require crisis to scare people into joining their group, and to harrass and intimidate local businesses into supporting them financially. That is NOT 'the cowboy way' to do business! And, yes, I am a granddaughter and daughterof, wife of, mother of, and grandmother of....some very GOOD cowboys, in the very best sense of that term. For the record, I also live in one of those 'large cattle numbers' states.

SD  |  September, 21, 2012 at 07:32 PM

Also for the record: those accusations of fraud by NCBA did not prove to be true.

The relationship between NCBA and USDA is that USDA has oversight to assure that all Beef Checkoff activities including projects and finances are according to the law.

The bookkeeping system has been complicated and periodic audits were built in to resolve issues resulting from that complexity. It has been changed as needed. THE ERRORS HAVE BEEN BOTH WAYS. Sometimes CBB has to return money to NCBA when legitimate expenses were denied by CBB, and sometimes NCBA has to return money to CBB when they could not agree if costs were valid. I really believe that NCBA has 'eaten' costs that it should not have had to bear.

NCBA has NEVER used ANY Beef Checkoff money for lobbying. I know, some people insist that is not correct, and they choose to refuse to believe the facts.

high plains  |  September, 21, 2012 at 10:27 PM

I just read R-Calf's letter. Reminds me of the saying, "Don't drink the bathwater"... Everyone has been through the allegations cafefully and it's time to get them behind us. Unfortunately, R-Calf's current leadership has an uncanniy ability to hitch their wagon's to falling stars.

Nebraska  |  September, 22, 2012 at 08:04 AM

I am getting tired of NCBA’s sin of omission, bearing a false wittness. For starters the checkoff was passed in 1985 by a vote of 20% of one million producers, yes of the one million cattle producer in 1985 250,000 voted and 200,000 voted yes. This is how they claim that it passed by 79%. If there is so much support why does the checkoff have to be manditory?

Next, yes contractors work on a cost recovery basis, that means they cannot charge more than the actual cost but they are allowed an IMPLEMENTION cost. NCBA’s is about $10 million. It used to be that NCBA did not have to disclose the IMPLEMENTION cost when bidding for contracts but all other organization did. This gave NCBA a great advantage over the other contractors. Subcontractors do not have live by cost recovery, therefore NCBA wins a contract and can charge the IMPLEMENTION cost while having a subcontractor do the actual work.

Billings, MT  |  September, 22, 2012 at 11:13 AM

Hello John,
You wrote an accurate article. You may have missed, however, the fact that R-CALF USA did not reference the phrase "the lawsuit," meaning the Callicrate lawsuit, when it wrote the phrase "join in a complaint againts you." That is because the R-CALF USA Board had already considered joining "the lawsuit" and did not decide to do so. So, I wrote the phrase to make it clear that R-CALF USA would not rule out joining in a new complaint. It is, at the very least, highly unetheical for these eight organizations to make up what they wanted R-CALF USA to say and then directly attribute "their" quote to R-CALF USA. That is the point: these eight groups have stooped to a new low in their attack of R-CALF USA. Purposefully misquoting written material should not be tolerated by professionals. Ignoring such a clear violation of ethics and integrity would be the equivelent of catching an organization in the act of misusing hundreds of thousands of producer checkoff dollars and then doing nothing other than to require them to repay what they took. If no one in our industry demands that our industry address issues ethically and with integrity, then our industry's credibility will quickly erode.

Upper Midwest  |  September, 22, 2012 at 03:15 PM

I agree with Deb ,until the NCBA quits sleeping with large packing companies ,we are pawns .

Nebraska  |  September, 22, 2012 at 06:29 PM

Next, CBB does NOT decide where the money is spent. The Operating Committee does. Read the ACT and ORDER. The Operating Committee consists of 10 CBB members and 10 Federation members. Federation is a non-legal entity of NCBA, therefore NCBA controls half of the Operating Committee. That is how NCBA wins 90% of the contracts. Do these other organization think that NCBA is going to give up $30 million in contracts?

Next, the misspending of money is true, the third party review proved it and NCBA had to repay CBB. CBB has never had to go back years to repay NCBA. A few years ago CBB’s CEO Tom Ramey pointed out that the NCBA’s Federation owed NCBA’s Policy a large sum of money, this was their own internal problem.

N  |  September, 22, 2012 at 06:32 PM

Next, 70% of NCBA’s budget is our checkoff dollars. In 2008 NCBA had over 126 listed employees. Do you expect everyone to believe that the $9 or $10 million NCBA gets from membership and other fees pays all the employees and lobbing effort? Read NCBA’s 990’s.

Next, In 1994 NC/NCBA had 40,000 members today they have about 26,000, that is only 3% of the cattle producers that pay checkoff. I don’t think that is the vast majority, it is more like the vast minority.

Last, if NCBA truly cared about the checkoff they would separate from the Federation a let it stand on its own. That is how King Solomon decided which woman really cared about the life of the baby.

I am tired of my checkoff dollars being used to prop up an organization that can not and will not stand on its own. If that is how you want to spend your money go ahead, but STOP taking mine.

Montana  |  September, 23, 2012 at 05:55 PM

Deb, your statement that most of us support a check-off that is HONESTLY used for our industry. Just shows that you have no idea how much the check-off does work for our industry.

Webbers Falls, OK  |  September, 23, 2012 at 11:58 PM

From reading his diatribe I doubt that Chris works at all and probably doesn't know which end of the cow the calf comes out of.